I thought I’d throw my own “Pearl Opinion” into the mix. This is my Amazon.com review of To Train Up a Child:
Not Christian At All, April 12, 2006I think a few of the main problems I have with this book lie in a couple of areas:
1. The Pearls view training children the way some people view training animals. Several times in TTUAC, Mr. Pearl states that the biblical way to train children is the same way we train a mule or a dog. He seems to ignore the fact that children are human beings made in God’s image. Biblically speaking, we are to treat human beings with a great deal more dignity and respect than a dog.
2. The Pearls set up an antagonistic relationship between parent and child. The child’s will must be subdued and conquered and the only way to accomplish this, it seems, is through switching. If parents fail to use this method, Mr. Pearl states that parents are creating a “Nazi.” He commands parents to look for opportunities to “thwart” the will of one’s children. I don’t see that in the Bible anywhere.
3. Obviously, parents react to the Pearls’ materials in different ways. I see TTUAC as a manual for child abuse. Pearl supporters claim its saved their homes. It seems to be a matter of interpretation. How can we know how anyone is going to interpret what is in that book? Even some Pearl supporters say that they don’t agree with everything they say which means there are elements that just don’t sit right with many, many people. I would hope that those folks ask why those elements bother them so much.
4. The Pearls represent themselves as biblical authorities on parenting and “child training”. Parents who don’t have a good support system in place tend to get desperate very fast. Mr. Pearl states in his introduction to TTUAC that once you read his book, the techniques will seem obvious and you’ll wonder why you didn’t figure it out on your own. Desperate people often tend toward extreme behavior. There are many MANY pro-spanking parents who feel that the Pearls’ methods are extreme. Switching for each and every single offense. Placing a child’s hands on a hot stove to teach him not to touch it. Shoving an unsuspecting child in a pool to teach them fear of the water. Hosing down a child who’s soiled his pants while learning to potty train as punishment for not using the potty.
Believe me, there are innumberable ways to raise godly children that have nothing whatsoever to do with the abuse advocated in this book.
5. This book is also full of horrible theology which I believe stems from the Pearls errant view on the nature of man.
6. The Pearls are just bad writers. They are totally unclear about several of their ideas and they contradict themselves in a number of places. Never show mercy to your child, show mercy to your child. Pick your child up when he cries, don’t pick him up when he cries. Things like that. I know for a fact that their style alone has left a number of parents totally confused about what to do with their kids. If the Pearls believe that consistency is the key, perhaps they should work on being more consistent in their writing.
Please, please don’t buy it. Amazon should stop selling it.
I’d give it zero stars if I could.
Again, another great article!
Thank you!
Who wrote this? (The only bummer about the cool new format is that it doesn’t show us who’s writing the posts–wah!). This was excellent.
I was at a used bookstore last week and found a TTUAC and did my first ever, “take it to the management” experience. I was apologetic and said that I didn’t want to make a fuss, that I understood if they had a “just stock everything” policy, but if they didn’t, then they might want to know that this book advocates switching babies as young as four months old in some cases, etc, and that it might not be a responsible thing to have on their shelves.
Their eyes bulged and they said, “No way!,” took it and put it behind the counter to check out later.
I used to hate people who did that…now I find myself grabbing cheap copies of Babywise (and TTUAC) at garage sales just so I can trash them when I get home.
It’s NOT that I’m anti-freedom-of-information…actually, that’s the one thing that really makes me sheepish about my book tossing habits these days. Technically, I’m all FOR reading things from many sides. It’s just that when you’re dealing with a young mother who’s totally in foreign territory, these books promise her the moon if she’ll just do it “their way,” right during a time when she’s HUGELY vulnerable…
And when strictly doing things “their way” involves things that are deeply damaging to babies on so many levels, I figure it’s worth buying cheap books for.
This was mine…
I’ve seen the Pearls speak, in person. They’re inflexible and self-satisfied…. I’ve also witnessed their methods in families I knew from church. It is heartbreaking to see children going around in silence, with sad little faces. The parents didn’t break their WILLS, they stole their PERSONALITIES.
It’s been a while since I read TTUAC, so i can’t say anything about it, but right now I’m reading Created to Be His Helpmeet by Debi Pearl. I’m also reading The Handmaid’s Tale by Margaret Atwood. I just finished listening to the audiobook Escape by Caroline Jessop. My mother gave me Created to Be His Helpmeet right before my wedding. At first I ate it up. I floated around like a little angelic puffball of goodness. Then that wore off and I got tired of feeling like a mindless servant. Personally, (being raised in a very strict setting) I agree with some of the Pearls ideas. But only what is supported by Biblical principles. A mom would have to be severely deceived to think abuse, degradation, and emotional torture are Biblical. The Pearls’ books should come with warnings. But then on the other hand, anyone who wanted to swallow all that hogwash would take the warning as an endorsement.
Cally, I love your new avatar!
Thanks! I wish I could say its me, but some clever Battlestar Galactica fanboy made it and I found it on a BSG message board. I really like it though. Its much better then the old one.
“This book is also full of horrible theology which I believe stems from the Pearls errant view on the nature of man.”
What is their view on the nature of man?
Molly, I only realized today that you can’t tell who has written what with our new format. I’ll be playing with themes and seeing if I can’t find something similar but which shows poster. This one was written by Jennifer/Cally.
We could just “sign” the posts…
[...] To Train Up A Child Review [...]
“What is their view on the nature of man?”
Michael Pearl on Original Sin
No Greater Joy: A Look at the Basics
(Comment in moderation, btw.)
Anne~
Nice job on fixing the format. I like the return of the numbers on the comments, too.
Spunky and I reviewed Created to be His Helpmeet in two podcasts last fall as part of the series on patriocentricity I did. Here are the links:
October 5th podcast:
http://thatmom.wordpress.com/2007/10/05/october-5-podcast/
October 12th podcast:
http://thatmom.wordpress.com/2007/10/12/october-12-podcast/
TG,
I am glad that you posted those links because it is crucial to understand the Pearl’s underlying theology in order to see how truly wrong their teachings are.
Now, what I really don’t get is why there are so many people who say they believe in God’s grace to them but with children it is a different story!
thatmom … thank you for all your hard work and noble labor in this area … you are dealing with gut wrenching stuff in an empathetic, courageous manner … I cannot imagine the grief you must have suffered and continue to suffer at the hands of those that are so firmly in this humanistic, unGodly patriocentric camp! Please know that you have many, many, many folks praying for you! Again, thank you.
Molleth wrote: “I was at a used bookstore last week and found a TTUAC and did my first ever, “take it to the management” experience. I was apologetic and said that I didn’t want to make a fuss, that I understood if they had a “just stock everything” policy, but if they didn’t, then they might want to know that this book advocates switching babies as young as four months old in some cases, etc, and that it might not be a responsible thing to have on their shelves.”
good for you!
We were asked to give certain websites just a few lines on why child training with the “rod of correction” in love – not anger – has given us joy in our household.
I am the mother of 3 boys….and when people say, “Wow, how are things going?” I respond by saying, “Life is eventful and FUN.” I wouldn’t be able to say that truthfully unless I used the rod of correction from a very young age to train my children. I’m not talking about beating children. I’m talking about consistent training with love, not anger. This book, “To train up a child,” by Michael and Debi Pearl, will help you to do that. We should form our opinions after reading the book. I see that some of you have. Thank you.
It sounds like we have the same goal in mind, “To train our children to the glory of God.” Let the Spirit lead you.
Dear Amanda,
Thank you for sharing your Pearl’s experience. And please, allow me to share a few thoughts, if I may.
First, I believe that you could have a fun and eventful life with your children with the rod of correction that is: consistent discipline. Not a physical rod for switching, but consistent teaching and discipline. I am the mother of five children, and I can honestly say that our life is eventful and fun. I say that truthfully, I can say this because we DON’T use a rod for correction.
Second, I’m glad that you are able to use these methods with love and not anger. But not everyone is like you. And I believe that you could teach your children the things you wish without the rod.
Third, in fairness, because I’m one of the authors of this site, I have to say that none of us here at White Washed Feminists believes that the Pearl’s materials will teach you to raise good kids. I believe that if you raise good kids using the Pearl’s materials, it was despite them, not because of them.
If you can raise good Godly children who love the Lord using the grace that God shows us, providing consequences, but not physical punishment…If you can raise children who are well behaved without spanking or switching….Why NOT?
And lastly? Can you imagine Jesus switching a child with a rod? Even without anger?
I was going to reply in a similar fashion, Anne. We use the “rod of correction” several times a day in our house. The rod is not a physical implement or our hands and we don’t use it to physically strike our children… however, we do DISCIPLINE each and every day whenever it is necessary.
There’s a lot I could say about the Pearls “ministry”… but I won’t. I let their materials and their heresy speak for themselves.
I have not read the Pearl’s book, so I will not comment on the book itself. I will, however, say that I agree that there are times when physical punishment is necessary and to not use it at those times would be sin.
Swinging the pendulum away from the perceived abusive techniques promoted by the Pearls to the opposite side where parents are told to never use physical punishment is the same error filled with the same judgmentalism – just coming from the opposite side. A balanced view of child discipline is called for here. Jumping emotionally into one camp or the other is ill-advised.
Amanda – I have read that the Pearl’s have suggested the use of PVC pipe in child discipline. This is simply abuse at a level that is (and should be) illegal. Doctors, teachers, and social workers are required by law to report people that they suspect of physically abusing children to the social services. Since I have not read this quote myself I will simply say that if the Pearls have suggested this, it would be absolutely appropriate and advisable for and doctors, teachers, neighbors, or friends to report anyone proclaiming the benefits of using the Pearl’s techniques to the proper authorities. Not a report of observed abuse, but a report of high probability of abuse.
We all need to be very careful of who is teaching us and the advice we are receiving and putting into practice. I suspect that many people who have read the Pearls and put their advice into practice would be appalled to hear that they may have suggested using PVC pipe on a child. I think they would rightly be appalled also if anyone here suggested that PVC pipe should be used against the Pearls themselves. But if they have recommended using PVC pipe in child discipline, I will be the first to say that the appropriate punishment would be for the Pearl’s themselves to be disciplined with PVC pipe. In fact, I’ll volunteer to administer the spanking.
I will, however, say that I agree that there are times when physical punishment is necessary and to not use it at those times would be sin.
Richard, could you give an example of when you think it would be sin NOT to spank?
Yes – Not spanking when it the proper form of discipline would be spanking would be a sin.
No – I can’t describe that for anyone else because I don’t parent their children. But there are times when it is absolutely the only proper response for some children given certain circumstances. I am thinking of my son in this instance because, after all, he is my only frame of reference.
What I’m trying to say here is that telling other parents that they cannot ever spank is wrong. It is just as wrong as telling other parents that they must spank. It is just as wrong as telling others that they cannot work outside the home or that if their husbands don’t make enough money to support the entire family the husbands are not properly providing.
We need to seek to do what is right before God based on what scripture tells us and stop trying so hard to force others to do things our way.
Sorry – just kind of a pet peeve of mine.
That first sentence should read:
Yes – Not spanking when the proper form of discipline would be spanking would be a sin.
I’ve read a copy of the Pearl’s book online and I was indeed disturbed by the material.
I find it weird how they distinguish between “good” children and “bad” children. “Good” children are the kids that leave their parents alone all the time and never make a fuss or bother to them at all. I thought this was strange because I wouldn’t really want my 16 mos. old daughter leaving me for 2 hours straight and not even caring about where I was. Call me attached but I like to have a relationship with my daughter.
Good kids are calm, obey on command the FIRST time, and sit still in chapel. Yea, most kids aren’t like this and I think the Pearls’ expectations are a little high so what’s their solution?
SWITCH!
That’s right hit your child from the time he/she is 4 months old if they don’t do exactly what you want. Put something that baby wants in his/her reach and if she tries to get it SMACK! That will teach him/her.
And if your 7 month old isn’t cooperating at bedtime (i.e. crying) switch him/her until she learns to lay still in her crib and not make peep.
I’m actually not against spanking at all. I just am against deliberately creating situations where your child will do something wrong and you spank them. I’m against spanking an infant that doesn’t know the difference between right and wrong. Spanking should be used to teach a child something and if it doesn’t, then why spank in the first place. Also, I don’t believe it’s the only way to discipline children.
Also this idea that the Pearls perpetrate that “if you don’t follow everything in our books just as we say your kids will end up really bad” sounds like their method of parenting is the ONLY applicable method of parenting, according to them.
I, personally, am anti-spanking, though I don’t judge other parents for doing so. But in the case of the Pearls, spanking itself is a secondary issue. It’s the way they do it.
Anne – you’ve hit on the pet peeve I mentioned in my earlier comment. I think your way of looking at this is exactly how we should look at almost everything. We are PERSONALLY responsible for what we do and we must live as we are guided by the Holy Spirit through our study of God’s word and prayer. (Sorry for the all caps, but apparently the new blog template doesn’t allow for HTML in the comments.)
Unless we are opposing heresy, we should not tell others how they are to live their lives. I think the authors and readers of this blog are quite good in this regard.
An exception to this general rule-of-thumb would be that I think we do need to be outspoken against things that we think are abusive. We may be wrong, but it is better to be wrong and shine the spotlight on something that is potentially so harmful than to remain silent when actual abuse is taking place. Degrees of definition of what actually consitutes abuse makes this hard and, for that reason, I think we need to make sure people are aware of what the Pearls seem to be proclaiming and why we think it is wrong. If it turns out that we are all wrong and have misjudged them, I’m sure we will all gladly repent of our mischaracterizations. But if we are right, hopefully some children will be saved from having to live through this sort of abuse under parents who truly love the children but are led astray by very bad advice.
Thanks, everyone, for allowing me to buck the tide on this without condemnation. I do not think spanking should be our primary means of discipline, but I don’t think we should rule it out entirely (at least not for families other than our own). It just must be done in a spirit of love and never, ever done in anger.
I think what frustrates you (and me and probably any number of folks who comment here) is when people on EITHER extreme get all up in arms whenever someone in the opposite camp even enters the room!
Extremism turns into fanaticism and its not the way to win anyone.
You’ve hit the nail on the head, Cally. And the fanaticism blogs and web sites reveal an appalling lack of thinking. It scares me. It’s very refreshing to be involved in ongoing discussions where folks can disagree politely and then everyone can learn together.
It’s funny; I love most of the Pearls’ articles and their lovely journal for wives, “Helpmeet’s Journey”. This is inspite of the fact that I’ve raved against them in the past, namely concerning their ridiculous anti-divorce law. I think their biggest fault is ignorance: they have no idea how abusive husbands work and how beaten wives become virtually brainless because of the abuse. They’re not blatantly dishonest like the VF cult; they truly, honestly think that abusive husbands will change for righteous wives and that children need spanking to be obedient.
I live in Nigeria and have never even heard of the Pearls. I’m not going to google them up because I am very opinionated and I don’t want someone telling me to be a doormat! Our traditions here already do enough of that, thank you very much.
About discipline and children, my people have a saying “there is a child for spanking and there is a child for speaking; no two children are the same”.
I had a happy and rich childhood… but my parents (my dad especially) would have been less frustrated if he had realised that I was not a child for spanking. The more I got spanked, the more rebellious I became. Once I skipped school for half day and when my dad found out, he beat me. The very next day I didn’t show up at school at all. He gave up. Of course if he had just called me and spoken to me gently, I would have been sooo good – well, almost. He did eventually figure that out. (I’m the eldest so I was kinda the experiment).
My cousin on then other hand is a child for spanking. That is the only thing that worked! You talk to her, you scold her, you advice…you try EVERYTHING and she still goes her way until she sees the switch…she usually doesn’t get spanked because once she feels there is a possibility of that happening, she eventually behaves.
However, while I will not presume to tell anyone how to raise their children, so long as it does not get abusive, I have also determined not to use the physical rod. If things get so bad, I’ll go on prayer and fasting. lol
Richard,
On PVC pipe. . .
I have not read all of the Pearls’ materials. I have not seen PVC pipe mentioned by them, that I recall.
However, among the implements they do endorse include:
Quote: “What instrument would I use?
As a rule, do not use your hand. Hands are for loving and helping. If an adult swings his or her hand fast enough to cause pain to the surface of the skin, there is a danger of damaging bones and joints. The most painful nerves are just under the surface of the skin. A swift swat with a light, flexible instrument will sting without bruising or causing internal damage. Many people are using a section of ¼ inch plumber’s supply line as a spanking instrument. It will fit in your purse or hang around you neck. You can buy them for under $1.00 at Home Depot or any hardware store. They come cheaper by the dozen and can be widely distributed in every room and vehicle. Just the high profile of their accessibility keeps the kids in line.
Quote: “. . .The hand on a diapered bottom is useless as a spanking, but effective in causing permanent damage to the spine. There is no surface pain to the child thus whipped. Any pain would be deep inside, similar to a fall or a car wreck. Any spanking, to effectively reinforce instruction, must cause pain, but the most pain is on the surface of bare skin where the nerves are located. A surface sting will cause sufficient pain, with no injury or bruising. Select your instrument according to the child’s size. For the under one year old, a little, ten- to twelve-inch long, willowy branch (striped of any knots that might break the skin) about one-eighth inch diameter is sufficient. Sometimes alternatives have to be sought. A one-foot ruler, or its equivalent in a paddle, is a sufficient alternative. For the larger child, a belt or larger tree branch is effective.”
Quote: “Use your own judgment as to what is effective. I found five to ten licks usually sufficient. . . .A general rule is to continue the disciplinary action until the child is surrendered. . . .”
When it comes to the Pearls, the “issue” is not spanking or not spanking. The issue is a combination of dominance in place of discipline, and perfectionism in place of reliance upon Christ.
oh good gravy …
Tulip Girl, thank you so much for quoting from the Pearls’ book … I have NEVER read any of their things … nor do I ever intend to do so
I agree with Sharon that certain discipline techniques work with certain children.
On three separate instances when my children were growing up, I spanked (swatted?) my children with a newspaper (so as not to hurt them but cause noise) three times. It was effective and helped my children stop whatever behavior that was inappropriate so much so that they did not do it again. (Frankly, I cannot remember what those instances were, but my children assure me that those three instances were absolutely necessary.)
There are many, many, many other options to use for discipline. If at all possible, it is very important to tailor make the discipline to fit the personality and learning style of the child (just like in homeschooling) … it is not a “one-size-fits-all” thing. Rightly or wrongly, I have always held that the goal of discipline is to teach something and to learn from a mistake/sin/error/misdeed/whatever.
Welcome, Sharon! I have some wonderful friends from Nigeria and have been so impressed with the rich traditions of the people. I appreciate your comments, and thank you for taking the time to share them.
Hi everyone,
I came across this blog after researching about TTUAC. I have a 17mth old daughter and I met a mom at the park who was very passionate about this book. I decided to do a little research on it and it is definetly not the way I would discipline my child. I can understand the occasional spanking for disobedience but this book seems way to extreme. It is appalling to think that alot of people are brain washed by this sort of parenting.
I don’t know if you are discussing the Shatzez and their connection with the Pearls; apparently they admitted to following them and killed their 7-year old daughter.
This is very painful-because I knew them. But I do believe they may have also been following a homeschooling group called Titus2.com (Teri Maxwell) from Leavenworth Kansas. Her website is much more just psychologically sick-it appears that her goal is to weaken the confidence of women, make them feel terribly abnormal for having human feelings and then turn them into sort of her version of a homely organic Stepford Wife. I’m not a mom but it is very clear that the gal knows how to create products and get insecure people to buy them.
She and her husband are in harmony with the Pearls in that they seem to refer to their children like animals. The husband-
Mr. Maxwell wrote a book about teaching your sons how to be single wage earners. Why not just love your sons? Then you can order things from Teri like “Chore Packs”…she seems a little like mommy dearest…scary oh-and a book
called Keeping the Hearts of Your Children; I can see why she wants to keep them…to make money off them….she write about a wife having a meek and quiet spirit-I dunno
maybe she has a ravenous spirit for control…I think maybe some of these wrong attitutdes can do more harm than..
it looks….in Christianity arent you supposed to live by faith?
THen WHY would you need instruction from people on every attitute every decision? Thats trusting in man
Eve, this post was written in 2006, long before little Lydia’s tragic death.